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	<title>Comments on: Guest Post: President Hugh B. Brown’s Most Famous Statement</title>
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	<link>http://www.keepapitchinin.org/2012/02/07/guest-post-president-hugh-b-browns-most-famous-statement/</link>
	<description>Where our past is never very long ago</description>
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		<title>By: Zelph</title>
		<link>http://www.keepapitchinin.org/2012/02/07/guest-post-president-hugh-b-browns-most-famous-statement/comment-page-1/#comment-197571</link>
		<dc:creator>Zelph</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Feb 2012 12:19:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.keepapitchinin.org/?p=16758#comment-197571</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[There are three talks that you are involved in:

The one you prepare. 

The one you give. 

And the one you wish you had given.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There are three talks that you are involved in:</p>
<p>The one you prepare. </p>
<p>The one you give. </p>
<p>And the one you wish you had given.</p>
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		<title>By: Th.</title>
		<link>http://www.keepapitchinin.org/2012/02/07/guest-post-president-hugh-b-browns-most-famous-statement/comment-page-1/#comment-197315</link>
		<dc:creator>Th.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Feb 2012 20:34:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.keepapitchinin.org/?p=16758#comment-197315</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[.

We are safe assuming those are still his words though, yes? That&#039;s how I interpret this.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>.</p>
<p>We are safe assuming those are still his words though, yes? That&#8217;s how I interpret this.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark B.</title>
		<link>http://www.keepapitchinin.org/2012/02/07/guest-post-president-hugh-b-browns-most-famous-statement/comment-page-1/#comment-197256</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark B.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Feb 2012 17:44:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.keepapitchinin.org/?p=16758#comment-197256</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Where are Pres. Brown&#039;s papers?  It seems that there might be a copy of the text among them, and someone could find it, see what&#039;s written on that page (are the words just as they were later printed?  or did he make some changes by hand in the typewritten text?  or, did he simply make the change on the fly as he delivered the speech?  and, one final &quot;or&quot; did he add the words after the speech was delivered to be included in the printed version?).

Good luck ferreting that out, dear ferrets!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Where are Pres. Brown&#8217;s papers?  It seems that there might be a copy of the text among them, and someone could find it, see what&#8217;s written on that page (are the words just as they were later printed?  or did he make some changes by hand in the typewritten text?  or, did he simply make the change on the fly as he delivered the speech?  and, one final &#8220;or&#8221; did he add the words after the speech was delivered to be included in the printed version?).</p>
<p>Good luck ferreting that out, dear ferrets!</p>
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		<title>By: Ardis E. Parshall</title>
		<link>http://www.keepapitchinin.org/2012/02/07/guest-post-president-hugh-b-browns-most-famous-statement/comment-page-1/#comment-197246</link>
		<dc:creator>Ardis E. Parshall</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Feb 2012 17:29:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.keepapitchinin.org/?p=16758#comment-197246</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I think I&#039;m glad that if the key line was part of only one version, it appeared in the printed text. If it had been given in the oral delivery but not in the printed version, we&#039;d have been treated to 40 years of conspiracy theories about who &quot;ordered&quot; President Brown to censor his remarks, and why, and what it all meant for freedom of thought in the Church.

As long as it worked out the way it did, it doesn&#039;t  matter to me that the line is missing from the oral delivery -- printed speeches in Conference reports and elsewhere (um, Congressional Record, anyone?) are seldom a verbatim record of the happenings at a meeting. This is how President Brown wanted his speech to stand, so there it is. (Not that I&#039;m not curious as to how and why this came about, but ultimately it doesn&#039;t matter.)]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think I&#8217;m glad that if the key line was part of only one version, it appeared in the printed text. If it had been given in the oral delivery but not in the printed version, we&#8217;d have been treated to 40 years of conspiracy theories about who &#8220;ordered&#8221; President Brown to censor his remarks, and why, and what it all meant for freedom of thought in the Church.</p>
<p>As long as it worked out the way it did, it doesn&#8217;t  matter to me that the line is missing from the oral delivery &#8212; printed speeches in Conference reports and elsewhere (um, Congressional Record, anyone?) are seldom a verbatim record of the happenings at a meeting. This is how President Brown wanted his speech to stand, so there it is. (Not that I&#8217;m not curious as to how and why this came about, but ultimately it doesn&#8217;t matter.)</p>
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		<title>By: kevinf</title>
		<link>http://www.keepapitchinin.org/2012/02/07/guest-post-president-hugh-b-browns-most-famous-statement/comment-page-1/#comment-197245</link>
		<dc:creator>kevinf</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Feb 2012 17:28:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.keepapitchinin.org/?p=16758#comment-197245</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[At least in this case we have both the transcription, and the recording.  Assuming, as did Grant and others above, that the transcript was edited with Pres. Brown&#039;s approval, I would believe we are safe in quoting the statement as an accurate representation of Brown&#039;s intent.  This becomes even more significant when you realize that many more people will encounter this talk in printed form than those who heard it in real time, or would take the time to listen to it via BYU&#039;s website.

But if I look at the different versions of the King Follett Discourse of Joseph Smith, we have a much more complicated situation determining what was said and meant.  It&#039;s not so easy to parse the details there in the absence of a recording, or of an edited transcript approved by Joseph Smith and published concurrently.

Thanks for pointing this out, Gary.  I was not aware of the difference between the talk as presented and the talk as printed.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>At least in this case we have both the transcription, and the recording.  Assuming, as did Grant and others above, that the transcript was edited with Pres. Brown&#8217;s approval, I would believe we are safe in quoting the statement as an accurate representation of Brown&#8217;s intent.  This becomes even more significant when you realize that many more people will encounter this talk in printed form than those who heard it in real time, or would take the time to listen to it via BYU&#8217;s website.</p>
<p>But if I look at the different versions of the King Follett Discourse of Joseph Smith, we have a much more complicated situation determining what was said and meant.  It&#8217;s not so easy to parse the details there in the absence of a recording, or of an edited transcript approved by Joseph Smith and published concurrently.</p>
<p>Thanks for pointing this out, Gary.  I was not aware of the difference between the talk as presented and the talk as printed.</p>
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		<title>By: J. Stapley</title>
		<link>http://www.keepapitchinin.org/2012/02/07/guest-post-president-hugh-b-browns-most-famous-statement/comment-page-1/#comment-197244</link>
		<dc:creator>J. Stapley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Feb 2012 17:15:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.keepapitchinin.org/?p=16758#comment-197244</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[A good reminder that oral texts and written texts don&#039;t always mach up.  I have been hoping for a long time for an analysis of nineteenth century of sermon reporting, but it is good to remember that it isn&#039;t simply a question for the distant past.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A good reminder that oral texts and written texts don&#8217;t always mach up.  I have been hoping for a long time for an analysis of nineteenth century of sermon reporting, but it is good to remember that it isn&#8217;t simply a question for the distant past.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark B.</title>
		<link>http://www.keepapitchinin.org/2012/02/07/guest-post-president-hugh-b-browns-most-famous-statement/comment-page-1/#comment-197240</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark B.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Feb 2012 17:08:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.keepapitchinin.org/?p=16758#comment-197240</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[President Brown was trained as a barrister, and it showed in his extraordinary public speaking.  It&#039;s altogether possible that the sentence in the published speech was in his prepared text, but that he chose for some reason to delete a few words as he gave the speech.

Maybe he remembered as he stood there in the Field House that he had to have lunch with President Wilkinson shortly afterwards, and didn&#039;t want to get him too riled up.

(And I&#039;m wondering what I thought was so important about my trigonometry class at Provo High, just across the street, that I didn&#039;t cut class to go hear Pres. Brown.)]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>President Brown was trained as a barrister, and it showed in his extraordinary public speaking.  It&#8217;s altogether possible that the sentence in the published speech was in his prepared text, but that he chose for some reason to delete a few words as he gave the speech.</p>
<p>Maybe he remembered as he stood there in the Field House that he had to have lunch with President Wilkinson shortly afterwards, and didn&#8217;t want to get him too riled up.</p>
<p>(And I&#8217;m wondering what I thought was so important about my trigonometry class at Provo High, just across the street, that I didn&#8217;t cut class to go hear Pres. Brown.)</p>
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		<title>By: David Y.</title>
		<link>http://www.keepapitchinin.org/2012/02/07/guest-post-president-hugh-b-browns-most-famous-statement/comment-page-1/#comment-197237</link>
		<dc:creator>David Y.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Feb 2012 17:04:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.keepapitchinin.org/?p=16758#comment-197237</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Fascinating post and interesting comments.  Good catch, Gary!  I would love to know more about how that wonderful line made it into the published version.  (To me, so long as the printed version was approved by President Brown, it&#039;s no big deal that he never actually spoken the line.)

#4 Re: &lt;em&gt;The Eloquent President&lt;/em&gt; as being &quot;a very good read for anyone who thinks that they might ever need to speak in public.&quot;  That would be pretty much every member of the Church, right?  . . . says the fellow who was asked to speak in Sacrament Meeting in a few weeks . ..]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Fascinating post and interesting comments.  Good catch, Gary!  I would love to know more about how that wonderful line made it into the published version.  (To me, so long as the printed version was approved by President Brown, it&#8217;s no big deal that he never actually spoken the line.)</p>
<p>#4 Re: <em>The Eloquent President</em> as being &#8220;a very good read for anyone who thinks that they might ever need to speak in public.&#8221;  That would be pretty much every member of the Church, right?  . . . says the fellow who was asked to speak in Sacrament Meeting in a few weeks . ..</p>
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		<title>By: Researcher</title>
		<link>http://www.keepapitchinin.org/2012/02/07/guest-post-president-hugh-b-browns-most-famous-statement/comment-page-1/#comment-197207</link>
		<dc:creator>Researcher</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Feb 2012 15:52:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.keepapitchinin.org/?p=16758#comment-197207</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[And, one more comment:

&lt;em&gt;The Eloquent President: A Portrait of Lincoln Through his Words&lt;/em&gt; (Ronald White, Jr., 2005) is an exploration of Lincoln&#039;s speeches: the writing, the delivery, and the subsequent editing for publication. If you&#039;re interested in the difference between spoken and written words, that is a fascinating look at the topic, and a very good read for anyone who thinks that they might ever need to speak in public.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And, one more comment:</p>
<p><em>The Eloquent President: A Portrait of Lincoln Through his Words</em> (Ronald White, Jr., 2005) is an exploration of Lincoln&#8217;s speeches: the writing, the delivery, and the subsequent editing for publication. If you&#8217;re interested in the difference between spoken and written words, that is a fascinating look at the topic, and a very good read for anyone who thinks that they might ever need to speak in public.</p>
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		<title>By: Researcher</title>
		<link>http://www.keepapitchinin.org/2012/02/07/guest-post-president-hugh-b-browns-most-famous-statement/comment-page-1/#comment-197205</link>
		<dc:creator>Researcher</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Feb 2012 15:49:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.keepapitchinin.org/?p=16758#comment-197205</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Interesting question. Does it matter?

The last time I spoke, the previous speaker ended five minutes before the meeting was supposed to end. Normally I would have cut my talk to from the 15 to 20 minutes I was asked to prepare to five minutes, but darn it, I prayed long and hard over the talk and had had strong impressions about what the members of the ward needed to hear (grief and mourning and depression and the plan of salvation and the resurrection), so I cut as much as I could cut and still say something cohesive, and the last five minutes of the talk I listened for the rise in noise that means that people are done with the meeting, done with the speakers, and poking their kids to prompt them to interrupt the speaker. The noise level never rose, so I finished the talk in ten minutes. (And then spent the hour during Sunday School talking with people who approached me, needing to discuss the subject further.)

That&#039;s a long way to say that the printed version of my talk was much different than what I actually said. I left out half of the material and added a couple of lines while I was speaking. If I was given to publishing my sacrament meeting talks, that talk would read quite differently than what the congregation heard.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Interesting question. Does it matter?</p>
<p>The last time I spoke, the previous speaker ended five minutes before the meeting was supposed to end. Normally I would have cut my talk to from the 15 to 20 minutes I was asked to prepare to five minutes, but darn it, I prayed long and hard over the talk and had had strong impressions about what the members of the ward needed to hear (grief and mourning and depression and the plan of salvation and the resurrection), so I cut as much as I could cut and still say something cohesive, and the last five minutes of the talk I listened for the rise in noise that means that people are done with the meeting, done with the speakers, and poking their kids to prompt them to interrupt the speaker. The noise level never rose, so I finished the talk in ten minutes. (And then spent the hour during Sunday School talking with people who approached me, needing to discuss the subject further.)</p>
<p>That&#8217;s a long way to say that the printed version of my talk was much different than what I actually said. I left out half of the material and added a couple of lines while I was speaking. If I was given to publishing my sacrament meeting talks, that talk would read quite differently than what the congregation heard.</p>
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