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	<title>Comments on: The Swiss Saints Contact the Church, 1944</title>
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	<link>http://www.keepapitchinin.org/2010/07/13/the-swiss-saints-contact-the-church-1944/</link>
	<description>Where our past is never very long ago</description>
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		<title>By: Ardis E. Parshall</title>
		<link>http://www.keepapitchinin.org/2010/07/13/the-swiss-saints-contact-the-church-1944/comment-page-1/#comment-26098</link>
		<dc:creator>Ardis E. Parshall</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Sep 2010 10:40:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.keepapitchinin.org/?p=7356#comment-26098</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[You write English beautifully, Christian; thanks for your comment. 

What a treasure for church history and for the Saints in Switzerland that your grandfather made such a detailed record! I wish I read German so that I could read your reports. The testimonies of &quot;normal&quot; members as you call them, especially given during such difficult times, must be inspiring to read.

I also appreciate your confirmation that the Saints were faithful during those days -- I have no doubt of that -- and that they were so unified. 

Thank you.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You write English beautifully, Christian; thanks for your comment. </p>
<p>What a treasure for church history and for the Saints in Switzerland that your grandfather made such a detailed record! I wish I read German so that I could read your reports. The testimonies of &#8220;normal&#8221; members as you call them, especially given during such difficult times, must be inspiring to read.</p>
<p>I also appreciate your confirmation that the Saints were faithful during those days &#8212; I have no doubt of that &#8212; and that they were so unified. </p>
<p>Thank you.</p>
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		<title>By: Christian Gräub</title>
		<link>http://www.keepapitchinin.org/2010/07/13/the-swiss-saints-contact-the-church-1944/comment-page-1/#comment-26088</link>
		<dc:creator>Christian Gräub</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Sep 2010 07:04:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.keepapitchinin.org/?p=7356#comment-26088</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[This article has been forwarded to me by a good friend. Thank you for publishing that letter. It is very interesting; from several of the conferences that Brother Zimmer mentions in his letter I have detailed reports, because my grandfather at that time was called as a secretary for such conferences, hold in Zurich; he was baptized in 1942 but had been an investigator of the Church since he met my grandmother around 1937 in St. Gallen. The first member of the Church in my family was the grandmother of my grandmother, and she was baptized 1897 in St. Margrethen near the Austrian border.

So, when my grandfather got that first calling, he thought that he had to report as he had done in his business all the time and noted not only the speakers, numbers of persons attending the meeting, Hymns that where sung a.s.f, but wrote down every single word that had been spoken on each conference session. So it came that we still have very detailed records of conferences hold in Zurich in 1943 and 1944 and it is awesome to read now the talks of the Swiss leaders in those days, also the testimonies of &quot;normal&quot; members, given at these conferences. 

Then, the brethren told my grandfather that they don&#039;t expect such a detailed report and he then just noted what was expected.

I can confirm from my own family history, that there was never a &quot;great apostasy&quot; here in Switzerland and in whole Europe during WWII. Contrariwise the members where stronger in faith and had more unity in these dark days than ever before. Such rumors are not just not true, I think they are abusive for all the Saints who brought forth the work in Europe even in the times of war.

I&#039;m sorry that this is not written in perfect English since my first language is German.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This article has been forwarded to me by a good friend. Thank you for publishing that letter. It is very interesting; from several of the conferences that Brother Zimmer mentions in his letter I have detailed reports, because my grandfather at that time was called as a secretary for such conferences, hold in Zurich; he was baptized in 1942 but had been an investigator of the Church since he met my grandmother around 1937 in St. Gallen. The first member of the Church in my family was the grandmother of my grandmother, and she was baptized 1897 in St. Margrethen near the Austrian border.</p>
<p>So, when my grandfather got that first calling, he thought that he had to report as he had done in his business all the time and noted not only the speakers, numbers of persons attending the meeting, Hymns that where sung a.s.f, but wrote down every single word that had been spoken on each conference session. So it came that we still have very detailed records of conferences hold in Zurich in 1943 and 1944 and it is awesome to read now the talks of the Swiss leaders in those days, also the testimonies of &#8220;normal&#8221; members, given at these conferences. </p>
<p>Then, the brethren told my grandfather that they don&#8217;t expect such a detailed report and he then just noted what was expected.</p>
<p>I can confirm from my own family history, that there was never a &#8220;great apostasy&#8221; here in Switzerland and in whole Europe during WWII. Contrariwise the members where stronger in faith and had more unity in these dark days than ever before. Such rumors are not just not true, I think they are abusive for all the Saints who brought forth the work in Europe even in the times of war.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m sorry that this is not written in perfect English since my first language is German.</p>
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		<title>By: Ardis E. Parshall</title>
		<link>http://www.keepapitchinin.org/2010/07/13/the-swiss-saints-contact-the-church-1944/comment-page-1/#comment-24491</link>
		<dc:creator>Ardis E. Parshall</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 Jul 2010 00:04:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.keepapitchinin.org/?p=7356#comment-24491</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Thanks for your comment, Roger; this is the first I&#039;ve heard of your new book, but it&#039;s a topic that interests a lot of readers, including me, so I&#039;ll watch for it.

I think we&#039;ve been pretty good at Keepa to keep the rumors down. Sometimes, as in this case, you have to mention the existence of such rumors in order to say &quot;but they aren&#039;t true; rather, *this* is true.&quot; As you and I and others have noted in this thread and through other posts, the Saints in Europe did remarkably well at maintaining church doctrine and practice, and very often went to heroic measures to minister to each other in the midst of the chaos. Read about &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.keepapitchinin.org/2008/06/15/geertruida-lodder-zippro-the-extra-mile-redux/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Gertruida Lodder Zippro&lt;/a&gt;, for instance, or Steve C.&#039;s post on the &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.keepapitchinin.org/2008/11/25/the-way-we-were-july-1942-german-edition/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;state of the church&lt;/a&gt; in Germany in July 1942. The Saints in wartime Europe provide models for us in so many ways.

Please excuse me for not citing sources. I do historical research (church and Utah history) for a living, and guarding my sources is the only workable way I&#039;ve found to balance both sharing stories with readers and protecting my own investment in time and effort.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for your comment, Roger; this is the first I&#8217;ve heard of your new book, but it&#8217;s a topic that interests a lot of readers, including me, so I&#8217;ll watch for it.</p>
<p>I think we&#8217;ve been pretty good at Keepa to keep the rumors down. Sometimes, as in this case, you have to mention the existence of such rumors in order to say &#8220;but they aren&#8217;t true; rather, *this* is true.&#8221; As you and I and others have noted in this thread and through other posts, the Saints in Europe did remarkably well at maintaining church doctrine and practice, and very often went to heroic measures to minister to each other in the midst of the chaos. Read about <a href="http://www.keepapitchinin.org/2008/06/15/geertruida-lodder-zippro-the-extra-mile-redux/" rel="nofollow">Gertruida Lodder Zippro</a>, for instance, or Steve C.&#8217;s post on the <a href="http://www.keepapitchinin.org/2008/11/25/the-way-we-were-july-1942-german-edition/" rel="nofollow">state of the church</a> in Germany in July 1942. The Saints in wartime Europe provide models for us in so many ways.</p>
<p>Please excuse me for not citing sources. I do historical research (church and Utah history) for a living, and guarding my sources is the only workable way I&#8217;ve found to balance both sharing stories with readers and protecting my own investment in time and effort.</p>
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		<title>By: Roger P. Minert</title>
		<link>http://www.keepapitchinin.org/2010/07/13/the-swiss-saints-contact-the-church-1944/comment-page-1/#comment-24488</link>
		<dc:creator>Roger P. Minert</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 24 Jul 2010 21:33:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.keepapitchinin.org/?p=7356#comment-24488</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I forgot to ask: what is the source of the Zimmer letter?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I forgot to ask: what is the source of the Zimmer letter?</p>
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		<title>By: Roger P. Minert</title>
		<link>http://www.keepapitchinin.org/2010/07/13/the-swiss-saints-contact-the-church-1944/comment-page-1/#comment-24487</link>
		<dc:creator>Roger P. Minert</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 24 Jul 2010 21:32:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.keepapitchinin.org/?p=7356#comment-24487</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Dear Friends,

Several reader comments indicate the possibility that church practices in Europe during the war might have been altered or perverted due to the isolation from Salt Lake City. Please do not circulate such rumors. In my study of the LDS Germans in World War II (see the new book &quot;In Harm&#039;s Way: East German Latter-day Saints in World War II&quot;), I have come across not one such incident, while debunking many myths. Those myths I will not mention here because they might be forwarded as truths. The German LDS worked miracles in preserving the programs and practices of the Church. When the foreign missionaries returned, they found no inappropriate practices. Thanks for the story. For more contemporary information about U.S. airmen interned in Switzerland in World War II (as required by international law), you will find several interesting articles in the Deseret News beginning in about 1944.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dear Friends,</p>
<p>Several reader comments indicate the possibility that church practices in Europe during the war might have been altered or perverted due to the isolation from Salt Lake City. Please do not circulate such rumors. In my study of the LDS Germans in World War II (see the new book &#8220;In Harm&#8217;s Way: East German Latter-day Saints in World War II&#8221;), I have come across not one such incident, while debunking many myths. Those myths I will not mention here because they might be forwarded as truths. The German LDS worked miracles in preserving the programs and practices of the Church. When the foreign missionaries returned, they found no inappropriate practices. Thanks for the story. For more contemporary information about U.S. airmen interned in Switzerland in World War II (as required by international law), you will find several interesting articles in the Deseret News beginning in about 1944.</p>
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		<title>By: Francis d'Evegnee/Devignez</title>
		<link>http://www.keepapitchinin.org/2010/07/13/the-swiss-saints-contact-the-church-1944/comment-page-1/#comment-24359</link>
		<dc:creator>Francis d'Evegnee/Devignez</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Jul 2010 14:57:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.keepapitchinin.org/?p=7356#comment-24359</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[The Brother Devignez spoken of in this article is my father, Paul Joseph Devignez/d&#039;Evegnee.  He was acting Mission President for Southern Belgium during WW2. You had written an article about his father, Charles Devignez and his service to the Saints in Liege, Belgium during WW1 along with Brothers Huysecom and Horbach.  Paul and family moved to the states in 1949 and settled in Danbury, CT where he eventually became Bishop of the Trumbull, Ct Ward.  He serve on the then Manhatten Stake High Council for the remaining years of his working life.  He died in Clearwater, Florida in 1992.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The Brother Devignez spoken of in this article is my father, Paul Joseph Devignez/d&#8217;Evegnee.  He was acting Mission President for Southern Belgium during WW2. You had written an article about his father, Charles Devignez and his service to the Saints in Liege, Belgium during WW1 along with Brothers Huysecom and Horbach.  Paul and family moved to the states in 1949 and settled in Danbury, CT where he eventually became Bishop of the Trumbull, Ct Ward.  He serve on the then Manhatten Stake High Council for the remaining years of his working life.  He died in Clearwater, Florida in 1992.</p>
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		<title>By: Ardis E. Parshall</title>
		<link>http://www.keepapitchinin.org/2010/07/13/the-swiss-saints-contact-the-church-1944/comment-page-1/#comment-24201</link>
		<dc:creator>Ardis E. Parshall</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 17 Jul 2010 12:28:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.keepapitchinin.org/?p=7356#comment-24201</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[DFB, it&#039;s a pleasure to have you comment here. Your father, his mission, and his book have been mentioned several times on posts with WWII themes. Your corroboration of his statements that the European Saints remained faithful is very welcome.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>DFB, it&#8217;s a pleasure to have you comment here. Your father, his mission, and his book have been mentioned several times on posts with WWII themes. Your corroboration of his statements that the European Saints remained faithful is very welcome.</p>
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		<title>By: David Frederick Babbel</title>
		<link>http://www.keepapitchinin.org/2010/07/13/the-swiss-saints-contact-the-church-1944/comment-page-1/#comment-24200</link>
		<dc:creator>David Frederick Babbel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 17 Jul 2010 12:01:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.keepapitchinin.org/?p=7356#comment-24200</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I appreciated the observation of Ardis E. Parshall about how well the Saints coped with the disruption of communication between them and headquarters.  My father, Frederick W. Babbel (author of On Wings of Faith, missionary companion to Elder Ezra Taft Benson) often expressed dismay about the notions of widespread apostasy that occurred in Europe during the war.  He and Elder Benson visited all of the countries involved and met with the members in each place they visited, and they observed no such thing.  
Sure, there could have been an isolated incident or two, but the Saints thrived in whatever way they could, led solely by their prayers and the Holy Spirit.  God did not let them down.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I appreciated the observation of Ardis E. Parshall about how well the Saints coped with the disruption of communication between them and headquarters.  My father, Frederick W. Babbel (author of On Wings of Faith, missionary companion to Elder Ezra Taft Benson) often expressed dismay about the notions of widespread apostasy that occurred in Europe during the war.  He and Elder Benson visited all of the countries involved and met with the members in each place they visited, and they observed no such thing.<br />
Sure, there could have been an isolated incident or two, but the Saints thrived in whatever way they could, led solely by their prayers and the Holy Spirit.  God did not let them down.</p>
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		<title>By: Heather Laurence</title>
		<link>http://www.keepapitchinin.org/2010/07/13/the-swiss-saints-contact-the-church-1944/comment-page-1/#comment-24128</link>
		<dc:creator>Heather Laurence</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Jul 2010 07:49:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.keepapitchinin.org/?p=7356#comment-24128</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Wonderful post!  I’m a long-time lurker, but I think some of my stake and family members can fill in parts of this story:

My father stayed with the Zimmer family on at least two occasions while he was waiting to return home from WWII.  (I’ve emailed two photos he took of the Zimmers; unfortunately Brother Zimmer was very camera shy and refused to be photographed.)  In March, 1946, Brother Zimmer asked my father to transport a duffel of Church materials to the Saints in Germany, which he agreed to do.  My father handed over one of his military duffels, which Brother Zimmer returned to him so full and heavy that he could hardly carry it.  My father was met in Strasbourg by the designated pick-up man.  He said the whole experience was very “cloak and dagger.”

Before being sent overseas, my father was set apart by his uncle, David O. McKay, to be a sort of undercover home teacher:  he was given a list of Saints to visit throughout Germany.  It would have been too dangerous to smuggle religious materials to them at that time, but he was instructed to meet with them and then report back on how the Saints were doing.

The “dear friend Brother Biehl” mentioned at the end of Brother Zimmer’s letter was the uncle to a Fred Biehl in my stake (Seattle North).  The Biehl family, five brothers and two sisters, lived in Essen, Germany.  The two oldest brothers, Walter and Fritz, were actively involved in church leadership before and during the war.  Walter was a branch president.  This article from Meridian Magazine tells the story of how he and his brothers helped an American sister missionary serving in Germany escape to Holland:
&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.meridianmagazine.com/turninghearts/030826dead.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://www.meridianmagazine.com/turninghearts/030826dead.html&lt;/a&gt;

Fred writes, “What is so nostalgic about this particular article is the reference to the whistling of DO WHAT IS RIGHT, the 1st several notes as a signal to other members of the church that may be listening.  My father continued that throughout our lives, whenever we were in crowded surroundings, whenever we were out camping, out playing in the neighborhood and he wanted us to come we would hear those notes and come running.”

Walter and Fritz Biehl never came home from the war, either dying or missing in action.  Kurt (Fred’s father) and Alfred were both wounded in the war, each coming home with shrapnel in the leg.  John was too young to be in the service.
Kurt, his wife and sons, and younger brother John later immigrated to the United States, settling in Seattle, Washington, where many of their descendants still live and serve in the church today.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wonderful post!  I’m a long-time lurker, but I think some of my stake and family members can fill in parts of this story:</p>
<p>My father stayed with the Zimmer family on at least two occasions while he was waiting to return home from WWII.  (I’ve emailed two photos he took of the Zimmers; unfortunately Brother Zimmer was very camera shy and refused to be photographed.)  In March, 1946, Brother Zimmer asked my father to transport a duffel of Church materials to the Saints in Germany, which he agreed to do.  My father handed over one of his military duffels, which Brother Zimmer returned to him so full and heavy that he could hardly carry it.  My father was met in Strasbourg by the designated pick-up man.  He said the whole experience was very “cloak and dagger.”</p>
<p>Before being sent overseas, my father was set apart by his uncle, David O. McKay, to be a sort of undercover home teacher:  he was given a list of Saints to visit throughout Germany.  It would have been too dangerous to smuggle religious materials to them at that time, but he was instructed to meet with them and then report back on how the Saints were doing.</p>
<p>The “dear friend Brother Biehl” mentioned at the end of Brother Zimmer’s letter was the uncle to a Fred Biehl in my stake (Seattle North).  The Biehl family, five brothers and two sisters, lived in Essen, Germany.  The two oldest brothers, Walter and Fritz, were actively involved in church leadership before and during the war.  Walter was a branch president.  This article from Meridian Magazine tells the story of how he and his brothers helped an American sister missionary serving in Germany escape to Holland:<br />
<a href="http://www.meridianmagazine.com/turninghearts/030826dead.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.meridianmagazine.com/turninghearts/030826dead.html</a></p>
<p>Fred writes, “What is so nostalgic about this particular article is the reference to the whistling of DO WHAT IS RIGHT, the 1st several notes as a signal to other members of the church that may be listening.  My father continued that throughout our lives, whenever we were in crowded surroundings, whenever we were out camping, out playing in the neighborhood and he wanted us to come we would hear those notes and come running.”</p>
<p>Walter and Fritz Biehl never came home from the war, either dying or missing in action.  Kurt (Fred’s father) and Alfred were both wounded in the war, each coming home with shrapnel in the leg.  John was too young to be in the service.<br />
Kurt, his wife and sons, and younger brother John later immigrated to the United States, settling in Seattle, Washington, where many of their descendants still live and serve in the church today.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark B.</title>
		<link>http://www.keepapitchinin.org/2010/07/13/the-swiss-saints-contact-the-church-1944/comment-page-1/#comment-24114</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark B.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 Jul 2010 21:01:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.keepapitchinin.org/?p=7356#comment-24114</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[And so, on this day of days, my oldest daughter&#039;s 31st birthday, right between Orangemen&#039;s Day and Bastille Day, I learn something new.  

Thanks as always, Ardis!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And so, on this day of days, my oldest daughter&#8217;s 31st birthday, right between Orangemen&#8217;s Day and Bastille Day, I learn something new.  </p>
<p>Thanks as always, Ardis!</p>
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